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What if GM goes BK?

Discuss the 5th gen (Will there be?), spy photo's, rumors, etc

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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 11:36 pm
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ins0mnia24 wrote:
You guys hear anything about GM being in such bad shape that they are auctioning and sellling off their entire collection of GM museum, collector cars, one off cars, 1st last production cars ect,ect on Barret Jackson???

Have'nt heard about that one, yet. But, it wouldn't surprise me.
Simpleman'Z 28
Moroso CAI,Relocated AIT,TB bypass,Custom pcm tune,OE Zo6 Wheels,Falken FK452 tires, Hooker Competition cat-back exhaust, more mods coming.


Posted: Thu Jan 01, 2009 9:17 am
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In my humble opinion we have to look at the reality of the market place--which used to mean U.S., and now is defined as global. And, we all are looking for quality products and services at the lowest price. Another way of putting it is we simply vote with our dollar bill.

Since I have been alive I have seen the U.S. lose our dominance in electronics, i.e., Westinghouse, RCA Victor, etc. We have lost our huge steel industry (for those of you too young to remember; Birmingham, AL, Cleveland, OH, etc. The lumber industry has greatly diminished: It's cheaper to grow the trees here in the US and send them to the Pacific rim countries to process them into a product and ship them back. And now, the US Auto industry is on the mat going into the final count. Why is that? These legacy companies could not sell their products or raw goods because these raw goods could be had cheaper elsewhere. When these industries could no longer sell their raw goods they were forced out of business, and thousands of jobs disappeared as well here in the US. Why did this happen? Because there were labor forces overseas that could produce the raw goods cheaper and therefore, they won out. Companies that were looking for the best product for the money voted with their dollar bill. We may not want to admit it but there is a common thread throughout this--Labor prices. U.S. labor became too expensive and U.S. companies were unable to pass this cost along to buyers of goods who could find them cheaper elsewhere.

Historically, companies with organized labor have really only been companies in name. Management and the rank-in-file have always been adversarial and two distinct entities. It is basically two opposing organizations under a common umbrella. Organized labor’s number one goal is to get as much money from the company for its members as is possible. This means the possibility of striking if management does not agree with demands. You read a lot these days about the U.S. auto industries management always “caving in to union demand”. Really, management has, in most cases, two choices, pay what the union demands, or try to deal with a strike and survive. The fear of a strike is always uppermost in management’s mind. If a strike lasts long enough, there are opportunities lost and a company may be forced to liquate its assets, in other words, go out of business. You may remember Eastern Airlines, one of the nation’s largest carriers. As a result of the strike by the Machinists union, Eastern Airlines filed for bankruptcy protection in the Spring of 1989. Over 18,000 employees lost their jobs and pensions in one day, not including the thousands laid off or furloughed prior to the collapse. The labor union may have “won”, but they don’t have any place to go on Monday mornings anymore.

On the other topic, quality of goods and services, the U.S. has been credited with more inventions and product development than anywhere else in the world. We created the automobile for mass markets; we invented telephone, televisions, etc. I could go on and on. But, the one thing we are not good at is to perfect those products once they are created and continue to make them better. Hence, the Japanese took the Cadillac or Lincoln or Chrysler and eventually made a Lexus or an Acura out of them. They took the RCA TV and made a Sony out of it. They took over the electronics industry and soon they will own automobile industry. Once again why is that? That’s because we vote with our dollar bill. We all work hard for our money and want the best bargain (value and cost) we can get! I remember in the early eighties when the first Hondas were imported. Everyone laughed because they were so ugly and small. Why would anybody drive something like that? Well, Honda hung in there and over the years steadily improved the product to a point that they got it right, i.e., Honda Accord, Prelude, etc. They just perfected something that the U.S. created. Try to find a U.S. made TV anymore, but look what Mitsubishi did with it.

A majority of people in North American do not buy U.S. autos because they are junk and depreciate so quickly. They buy something that doesn’t cost them an arm and leg in repairs after purchase. Enter in the Nissans and Hondas.

I have been a supporter of the U.S. Autos all my life. I currently own a 2001 Silverado HD, a 2005 Grand Prix and a 2000 Camaro SS. I’ve spent over $3,000 US on the fuel tank and fuel quantity sensor replacement and another $1,500 on a transmission overhaul on the Silverado (I purchased it new so I know it hasn’t been abused). You go talk to dealers and they say, “Yeah, I know. We get a slew of these transmission jobs on this model of truck, because the discs don’t hold up.” However, it is always after the warranty has run out.

As quickly as possible, I’ve changed out struts and shocks on all three autos because OEM equipment is so cheaply made that the ride is sub par it eats up tires. OEM vs. Bilstein.

Like most of this community, I feel like I get a say in this because I have owned U.S. autos my entire adult life. But something has to give. I agree with the number of comments that the CEO’s need to take a financial hit for this situation, but the UAW leadership is going to have to face some hard realities as well such as getting labor prices in line. I respect each and every one of you that had fathers in the rank-in-file and you who are current members. I know this is volatile topic and we all feel like we are worth our salaries! I’ve been a victim of a reduction in salary in the past with my company so I do know the pain.

But, if the auto makers could get internal labor cost down some, perhaps they could throw some of that new found money at R&D to bring up quality in their products, etc. As far as reducing the product line of automobiles, the natural market forces will do that with the dollar bill vote.

In closing, I feel both sides (Management and Labor) are going to have to change from how things are being done today. The UAW- taking a hard stance- that it will not look at concessions is a recipe for demise. Management and Labor are going to have to get on the same page or we will see another industry go the way of Eastern Airlines. Labor won the battle and retained their wages, but don’t have anywhere to go on Monday mornings anymore.
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Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 10:45 am
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Yeh I didnt see any of the Gm cars on Barret Jackson..

On a side note if any of you have MSNBC check out their show GM Inside The Crisis..
The 1st half is pretty good they show how deep Gm problems affect smaller places and show how one of the small businesses that just make fastners and nut/bolts had to lay off and ect..
The rest of it turned into a Camaro/Volt commercial which was gay if you ask me..

Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:38 am
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ins0mnia24 wrote:
Yeh I didnt see any of the Gm cars on Barret Jackson..

On a side note if any of you have MSNBC check out their show GM Inside The Crisis..
The 1st half is pretty good they show how deep Gm problems affect smaller places and show how one of the small businesses that just make fastners and nut/bolts had to lay off and ect..
The rest of it turned into a Camaro/Volt commercial which was gay if you ask me..

I saw the 2na half of that show when they were talking about the New Camaro, and I thought it was pretty interesting to see all of the testing that they were doing. Then of course they had to get NASCAR's "spokes person" Dale Jr. on there to give his input about the car. All and all I'd say that that is a pretty good documentary.
1991 RS Camaro with a fresh 355 ci Small Block with several mods.



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