It is currently Mon Sep 06, 2010 11:27 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 41 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: True Duals On A Thirdgen 82-92 Camaro/Firebird
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 10:07 am 
Offline
* Moderator *
* Moderator *
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 6896
Location: Miramichi, NB
There are a few systems out there for putting true dual exhaust on your 3rd Gen and not the "fake" true duals. I have decided to make a little article since i plan on selling my exhaust for a "cheap" true dual exhaust setup.

Dynomax offers a true dual exhaust setup part number WLK-89009 on summitracing.com and is a headers back system and is 2.250". Mufflers are not included.

Image

The system i wanted to mention about, because it is cheap and gives you true duals, is a custom exhaust and may reduce ground clearance, but im lowered 2" with sportlines and still installing this setup. I think the single 2.5" i have now is a little restrictive.

The setup pictured below consists of:

Hedman Long Tube 68460 Headers $145.99
Hedman 3" Header Collector Extensions 2.5" 18700 $26.39
Summit 2.5" H-Pipe SUM-642025 $31.95
2.5" Moroso Spiral Mufflers MOR-94050 $49.88

TOTAL: 304.09

The headers include gaskets, bolts, and instructions, as well as the extensions. You may also want to include a set of turn downs, i will just get a couple locally.

Image
Image

_________________
'74 454 .030 Over 4.250 Stroke 489, SRP Forged 0.030 Flat Tops, Crane Z Blower .632/.632 244/256 Cam, Weiand 8-71 Polished Blower, 2 x 800cfm Barry Grant Blower Carbs, Procomp 320cc Heads Race Package, CSR Electric Water Pump, TH400 FUll Manual Reverse Valve Body Sportsman Trans Brake 3000 Stall, 9" Rearend 31 Spline 3.70 Gears.


Last edited by roughskinjrz on Fri Apr 13, 2007 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:56 am 
Offline
Minimum of 100 Posts
Minimum of 100 Posts

Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:05 pm
Posts: 130
Location: South Gate, CA
i wanna hear that baby roar!!!

grrrrrrr... :lol: :lol:

_________________
PrOpHiT***Z28 BABY


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 7:22 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 200 Posts
Minimum of 200 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 7:32 pm
Posts: 340
Location: New Jersey
i definally want to get that. 8)

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 7:28 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 80 Posts
Minimum of 80 Posts

Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:40 pm
Posts: 83
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: searching random Camaro stuff
nice!!! I may have to look into that

_________________
Nate

2003 Chevrolet S10: 39,000 miles, 4 cyl, 5 speed work truck, nothing special.

1984 Camaro Z28: High Output 305, 5 speed, 38,500 miles, Dark Goldwing Metallic (Brown)/Tan

1982 Camaro Z28: 350, 4 speed, set up for drag racing, Black

and many rental vehicles


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 9:28 pm 
Offline
** Administrator **
** Administrator **

Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2002 10:36 am
Posts: 11879
Location: Burnaby, BC. Canada
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: I am the Administrator :-)
:thumbup: Awesome article! :)

_________________
1992 Camaro Z28. Blue/silver, Custom Blue/Silver Leather seats, Rebuilt Engine, Cammed, Headers, TT ][ Rims ...
WWW.CAMAROSOURCE.CA
Over 2000 Pages
"Internet's Largest, Most Complete Camaro Resource Site"

Camaro Yearly Information Database

Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:28 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 20 Posts
Minimum of 20 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:15 pm
Posts: 23
Location: Tiffin, Ohio
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: thirdgen.org
did you get this installed yet? if so were there any clearence issues with it? (ground and body)


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:31 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 20 Posts
Minimum of 20 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:15 pm
Posts: 23
Location: Tiffin, Ohio
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: thirdgen.org
also any idea if a crossover (X pipe) would work instead of the H pipe?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:08 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 4000 Posts
Minimum of 4000 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 8:13 am
Posts: 4279
Location: New Jersey
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: Boobs
droptop406 wrote:
also any idea if a crossover (X pipe) would work instead of the H pipe?


If there is room to put an H pipe then there is room to put a X pipe cross over.
A few companies have X cross overs that end on a straight run so that both pipes can be run to one side which comes in handy for running both pipe up and around the Panhard bar

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 4:46 am 
Offline
* Moderator *
* Moderator *
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 6896
Location: Miramichi, NB
droptop406 wrote:
did you get this installed yet? if so were there any clearence issues with it? (ground and body)


i am lowered with sportlines so im pretty low to the ground right now. the new exhaust will be welded in on monday, so i dont have a welder a friend is doing it ill post videos and pics then.

_________________
'74 454 .030 Over 4.250 Stroke 489, SRP Forged 0.030 Flat Tops, Crane Z Blower .632/.632 244/256 Cam, Weiand 8-71 Polished Blower, 2 x 800cfm Barry Grant Blower Carbs, Procomp 320cc Heads Race Package, CSR Electric Water Pump, TH400 FUll Manual Reverse Valve Body Sportsman Trans Brake 3000 Stall, 9" Rearend 31 Spline 3.70 Gears.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 1:29 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 1000 Posts
Minimum of 1000 Posts

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 4:28 pm
Posts: 1918
Location: BallstonSpa NY
I read somewhere that the X or H pipe is just to stop the poping sound when letting off the gas.Anyone know if that is true and if you need to have one for some other reason. Never needed them in the old days when we just ran exhaust down both sides.

I just read that straight pipes only help make more hp at motors with high hp like 450 or above and y pipes help with lower hp cars . Also helps in lowering noise and pressure waves in the exhaust. Guess I answered my own .

_________________
Image
http://www.cardomain.com/id/camaro1093ac


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:35 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 4000 Posts
Minimum of 4000 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 8:13 am
Posts: 4279
Location: New Jersey
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: Boobs
Remember that radio and TV commercial about the piston engine going "Boing-Boing," when it out to go HUMM? Well, all V8 engines with 90 degree cranks, have an out of sync imbalance in their firing order between the right and left cylinder banks. Yes, they do go "Boing-Boing." The firing order imbalance is a necessary sacrifice for dynamic balance of the rotating and reciprocating crank, rods and pistons. Each time the firing order is completed (two full revolutional), two cylinders within each bank will fire and exhaust within 90 degrees of each other. These two cylinders will be exhausting into the header collector or exhaust manifold almost simultaneously. This overlapping condition creates a lot of back pressure and a pop sound. Meanwhile, the opposite exhaust manifold has no activity (or pressure) in it at all. This is where the characteristic, low harsh popping V8 sound comes from.

The most common way of reducing this out of sync imbalance is with rebalancing crossovers such as H pipes and over-and-under X style crossovers. These provide both noise reductions and efficiency (power) improvements. H pipes are effective only at low and mid range. The over-and-under X crossover works a little better but still does not completely rebalance the exhaust at high RPM.

Dr. Gas, Inc. has developed a new generation of crossovers that uses a tangentially siamese junction, in place of the H or over-and-under X. It evenly splits, smoothes, and synchronizes exhaust pressures at all engine speeds. The high and low pressure pulses in the two pipes are evenly imposed on each other, leveling out the pulse time history pressure differences between right and left cylinder banks. Re-synchronizing the exhaust pulses reduces back pressure, cancels sound, and provides additional scavenging. Tests have sound 6 dBa (75%) reduction in sound levels, and increases of 10 to 30 hp, and up to 40 ft-lbs. of torque! Economy, and throttle response are improved. Exhaust flow after the crossover is completely smoothed out. The job the headers started is finished.

One of the most appealing benefits of this system is the modified exhaust note. The deep growling and popping sound is replaced by a higher pitched smooth sound. The exhaust note is similar to a 180 degree header system without the nightmare of tubing.


Here's a clue. Bobby Labonte got upside-down at Daytona during his 125-mile qualifier and showed the world how his guys mate the exhaust from the right and left side of the engine. This system is similar to the one created by Dr. Gas. (Sam Cranston, Daytona Beach News-Journal)

The early-season upside-down adventure at Daytona of one Bobby Labonte provided onlookers with a worm's eye view of one of Winston Cup's best kept secrets - and solved the mystery of the unusual sound of two-time Daytona 500 winner Sterling Marlin's car. In 1995, most technically astute patrons at the NASCAR® season opener, including pit road reporter Mike Joy for CBS, perceived a different sound to Marlin's car, as if it were fitted with 180° headers. The next hypothesis - that the Morgan-McClure team was using a "flat" crank - was simple, logical… and dead wrong. Turns out it was the exhaust system past the headers that accounted for the change in engine note.

With Labonte's timely escapade, most observers figured they had a handle on the deal, The exhaust pipes were joined in an "X" pattern under the car. Close, but no cigar. That's when SCR decided to poke around. As luck (skill?) would have it, we discovered the real answer. And it wasn't even close to NASCAR®-land. The equipment responsible for the exhaust note originates from the sleepy confines of Sandy, Utah.

There, Boyd Butler, the owner of Pro Motorsports Engineering, has made an exact science out of exhaust system tuning. One of his products is the Dr. Gas crossover - the piece that has turned Winston Cup upside-down (figuratively.) Here's how it works.

All V-8 engines with 90-degree cranks have an imbalance in the firing order between the right and left cylinder banks. The firing order imbalance is a necessary sacrifice so that a dynamic balance of the rotating and reciprocating assembly (crank, rods and pistons) can be maintained. Each time the firing order is complete (two full revolutions of the crank), two cylinders within each bank fire and exhaust within 90 degrees of each other. Because of this, this pair of cylinders will be exhausting into the header collector (on one bank) almost simultaneously. This overlap creates a back pressure. Meanwhile, the header on the opposite bank has no activity (or pressure) in it at all. Conventional full-length four-tube headers help separate the exhaust in the cylinders until it reaches the collector. After the header primary tubes dump into the collectors, the two cylinders close to each other in the firing sequence again are fighting for space in both the collector and exhaust pipe. This results in reflected pressure waves traveling backwards though the exhaust system. What you get is more backpressure, diminished power and fuel economy, and the V-8's characteristic growl.

Wouldn't a traditional H-pipe crossover, or equalizer, allow some of this excess pressure to bleed over to the "quiet side" of the exhaust system? Jere Stahl ran 330 gallons of fuel through a pair of street engines in part throttle dyno testing to find out. One was a 350 small block, the other a 400 small block. Testing at 2550 RPM and 3050 RPM, primarily at part throttle, in HP ranges from 35 to 125, Stahl found that a balance tube actually hurt fuel distribution on every manifold/header combination he tested. It never helped at full-throttle power, either.

Some people have found small low and mid-range torque improvements using an H-pipe. But at high RPM, the gases cannot bleed across the H-pipe fast enough to help power very much. The double cross, X-crossover, is an improvement beyond the H-pipe, but does not resynchronize pulsing and pressure spikes completely.

That's where the Dr. Gas Crossover differs. It evenly splits the flow in the crossover junction. The pressures on both banks are equal and pulse-free after the crossover, regardless of RPM. In addition, secondary scavenging of the entire collector system occurs in both banks are equal and pulse-free after the crossover, regardless of RPM. In addition, secondary scavenging of the entire collector system occurs in both banks. Volumetric efficiency and power are improved at all engine speeds. Engines with high overlap cams (a typical race engine) will also see an improvement in idle quality.

As many observers at Daytona suggested, the engine exhaust not is changed with this system as well. The deep growl common to V-8s is replaced by a smoother, higher-pitched sound, almost like a high-RPM Japanese motorcycle engine or the shriek of an Indy car. Typical sound reductions of 4 to 6 DBA (a 75% decrease) are realized, with an overall increase in power.

Just now much power are we talking about? This is one of those "it depends" things. Every combination sees different gains, but in testing, the power increase range runs from 5-20 HP at wide-open throttle (with corresponding increases in torque output). Your typical Cup car can see something in the neighborhood of at least 5-10 HP in restrictor trim with this combination. Incremental gains are seen through the entire RPM range.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 8:17 am 
Offline
Minimum of 1000 Posts
Minimum of 1000 Posts

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 4:28 pm
Posts: 1918
Location: BallstonSpa NY
Thanks that was a good find. Not sure if I like the ricer sound lol. I guess when I do replace my exhaust I`ll try the old school 69 chambered system just for the heck of it ,if it sounds good I`ll put it in a clip and let everyone hear it. I know my 78 BB has straight duel pipes and they sound great. If it ever gets put back together I may get to drive it.

_________________
Image
http://www.cardomain.com/id/camaro1093ac


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 1:17 pm 
Offline
* Moderator *
* Moderator *
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 6896
Location: Miramichi, NB
well i just got my car back from the exhaust shop today, i took the old exhaust off myself, and installed the driver side long tube in. i couldnt get the car high enough to get the passenger side in so the exhaust shop did it. they had to take off the starter, while it was off and in the air i installed the braided steel transmission lines, also new spark plugs, and new motor mount bolts. took 5 hours to get it all installed with the extra work he had to do. here are a couple pics of the car, camera went dead when i tried to get pics of underneath, but the video will show how low the exhaust hangs, i didnt think it was that bad, but it is like 1-2 inches off the ground :? i've scraped a couple times but as long as you go slow over rail road tracks your fine, plus im lowered an extra 2".

(video may still be optimizing)
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/e829 ... 1f2e7f.htm

Image
Image

_________________
'74 454 .030 Over 4.250 Stroke 489, SRP Forged 0.030 Flat Tops, Crane Z Blower .632/.632 244/256 Cam, Weiand 8-71 Polished Blower, 2 x 800cfm Barry Grant Blower Carbs, Procomp 320cc Heads Race Package, CSR Electric Water Pump, TH400 FUll Manual Reverse Valve Body Sportsman Trans Brake 3000 Stall, 9" Rearend 31 Spline 3.70 Gears.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:21 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 100 Posts
Minimum of 100 Posts

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2004 6:04 pm
Posts: 130
Location: Norwich Ontario Canada
yup still optimizing


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:09 pm 
Offline
Minimum of 200 Posts
Minimum of 200 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 7:32 pm
Posts: 340
Location: New Jersey
it's working now. and the mufflers don't hang too low. Definally would be okay, sounds real mean too. :twisted:

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 3:33 am 
Offline
Minimum of 400 Posts
Minimum of 400 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 1:45 pm
Posts: 536
Location: easton PA
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: google
sounds awesome


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 4:30 am 
Offline
* Moderator *
* Moderator *
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 6896
Location: Miramichi, NB
yeah the link is working now.

_________________
'74 454 .030 Over 4.250 Stroke 489, SRP Forged 0.030 Flat Tops, Crane Z Blower .632/.632 244/256 Cam, Weiand 8-71 Polished Blower, 2 x 800cfm Barry Grant Blower Carbs, Procomp 320cc Heads Race Package, CSR Electric Water Pump, TH400 FUll Manual Reverse Valve Body Sportsman Trans Brake 3000 Stall, 9" Rearend 31 Spline 3.70 Gears.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 7:52 am 
Offline
Minimum of 20 Posts
Minimum of 20 Posts
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:15 pm
Posts: 23
Location: Tiffin, Ohio
Where Did You Hear Of Camarosource.ca?: thirdgen.org
definitely looks good clearence wise looks like you are leaking on the passenger side. also do they exit right before the rear tires couldn't really tell for sure. sounds good

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 8:59 am 
Offline
Minimum of 1000 Posts
Minimum of 1000 Posts

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 4:28 pm
Posts: 1918
Location: BallstonSpa NY
Looks and sounds nice.

_________________
Image
http://www.cardomain.com/id/camaro1093ac


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 9:38 am 
Offline
* Moderator *
* Moderator *
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 6896
Location: Miramichi, NB
droptop406 wrote:
definitely looks good clearence wise looks like you are leaking on the passenger side. also do they exit right before the rear tires couldn't really tell for sure. sounds good


it just stopped pouring raining outside so its just water dripping off the car after i opened the hood, nothing leaks.

also it does end right before the rear tires.

_________________
'74 454 .030 Over 4.250 Stroke 489, SRP Forged 0.030 Flat Tops, Crane Z Blower .632/.632 244/256 Cam, Weiand 8-71 Polished Blower, 2 x 800cfm Barry Grant Blower Carbs, Procomp 320cc Heads Race Package, CSR Electric Water Pump, TH400 FUll Manual Reverse Valve Body Sportsman Trans Brake 3000 Stall, 9" Rearend 31 Spline 3.70 Gears.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 41 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron



Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
i like big butts, free long sex movies, hot sexy milfs, free pictures of shaved pussy, topless beach girls, atk natural hairy special, rape mexican women, amature group, jennifer connelly dildo, paris hilton sex free, big gay military dick, asian girls in pantyhose, old dames open legs, mom son incest, reality porn sample videos, nylon overall fetish, notre dame cheerleaders, female orgasm tips tricks, nude girls in the shower, melon head by tim burton, paula abdul naked, atypical facial pain, sent outdoor decoration, free videos daughters getting fucked by there dad, sylvia comic strip, danielle shemale, louisiana breast silicone implants, wife cumshots, tight fuck, lesbians lingerie, free live football streams, experience speculum, toon panty, men dildo fucked, fat men porn, face sex, vagina closeup pics, thong g string models, penis photo pierced, fetish dvd, extreme sport photo, redheads masturbating, how to perform oral sex, panties in mouth, shaved close ups, werewolf fantasy art, armpit closeups, housewife sex, bikini sluts, disciplinary boot camp in mich, bdsm slave, jizz slut, blondes getting fucked, naked tall tanned men, old hairy clit, flexible females, teen rape, skinny black chicks, home made vagina, free movie rimjob, nipple twisting, trans jerk, paris hilton sex videos, ear getting pierced, black melon boobs, cam depot autorank, free movies cum swallow, suspenders & stockings, sylvia matthews, crossed legs skirt, gay sex dad son, girl orgasm sound, breast silicone implant new, young girl nudists, milf hunter sarah, beach sex, firefighter pants and uniforms, male orgasm tips, thong ass, free pussy pics, huge clothed boobs, dildo shower, sluts sucking big cocks, transparent sheer lingerie, free pics of bisexuals, older chicks, marrs and ass reality corsicana tx, american creampie, nurse pussy clips, teen flexible, asian adult, teen slut head oral swallow bj boise, free lesbian xxx, blowjob office, guidelines for appropriate outdoor casual dress, aniston jennifer paparazzi photo, watch movie clips, spread asshole, horse suck video, shaved milf pussy, tiny tranny, rimjob definition, fake nude celeb galleries, tattoo bdsm, tommy lee's dick, silicone breast augmentation pictures, ethnic ass, tanned boobs, hairy teens, gay teens fucking, free paris hilton sex tape, hot blonde, chronic sore throat, velvet revolver dirty little thing, bloodhound gang - foxtrot uniform charlie kilo mp3, voyeur video free, reading pa rape, shakira upskirt, swinger mom, sarah naked, cheerleader crossdressing, skinny wife, licked her asshole, cartoon sex, got jizz, asian erotica, hot secretary, interior office doors, bdsm training, outdoor peeing galleries, sexy french lingerie, hairy men big cocks, cartoon hot girls, amateur facials for free, nurse bj, jennifer garner nude, teen bikini pics, teenage male muscle galleries, anal lesbian, gauge gangbang, shower wall surround, indian wedding planning, live amateur housewife video, psychological tests for determining incest, topless beaches in florida, gay guys fucking, big natural tits, .net retro television, young girls hairless free, large pussy, teen in stockings, gay chubby chasers, fat plumper bbws, naked male celebrities, skinny dipping holiday, small dick porn, extreme technical, ebony milfs, memphis gangs, big women fat chicks